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 Post subject: Re: D1 final boss vs D2 final boss.
PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2015 6:57 pm 
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When modern games try to be challenging, it usually ends up being what I call "fake difficulty". Stuff like getting stunned (or worse stun locked), or generic status effects, or stealth missions that instantly fail when you are detected, basically design decisions that are unfair or unreasonable.

Descent is very challenging, but it isn't particularly fake or unfair difficulty (Well, unfair for the players anyway since the more skilled players are totally unfair from the perspective of the AI). A highly skilled Descent player will very much trivialize the difficulty and challenge, I used to be able to start a new game on Insane and beat levels 1-7 with no saves, no deaths, not even dropping under 100 shields, and I'd do it in like 1 hour or something. I'm sure if someone tried a speed run with similar criteria it would be possible to complete the entire D1 campaign less than one hour or something crazy like that (Youtube says D2 campaign [any%] is possible in 47 minutes).


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 Post subject: Re: D1 final boss vs D2 final boss.
PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2015 9:18 pm 
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Yea, if you just blow through, destroy the reactors and scoot…but I was always obsessed with killing every single robot. (yes, I know they die when the reactor blows… :P )

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 Post subject: Re: D1 final boss vs D2 final boss.
PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2015 10:04 pm 
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Krom wrote:
I'm sure if someone tried a speed run with similar criteria it would be possible to complete the entire D1 campaign less than one hour or something crazy like that (Youtube says D2 campaign [any%] is possible in 47 minutes).

Done at AGDQ this year in just under 50 minutes, but on Hotshot: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lD5BTUjVCtw

There were some mistakes in the run that wasted significant time - the expected duration was 46 minutes - but I'm not sure how feasible it would be to finish on Insane in less than 60, considering that. It might be possible if you did it perfectly. You'd have to avoid a lot more damage instead of running through it, which would definitely increase the time, but maybe not more than 14 minutes.


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 Post subject: Re: D1 final boss vs D2 final boss.
PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2015 3:51 pm 
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I just watched that speedrun by Spooty, and then I watched his D2 in 47 mins while I was at it. Amazing flying. Descent 1 appeared to be the harder game by a good margin in these runs.

As for D1 vs D2 design - another thing which annoyed me was the fact of how little respect was given to the D1 weapons in D2. Remember the first Smart Missile in D1? In a secret area, resting atop a pedestal. In a level which you had to beat a boss robot to reach. And in D2? Smarts are available starting from level 1 like they were no big deal. Megas? Available in the first secret level accessible from level 3, like they were nothing special.

What such practices create is a psychological effect where people are just made to think that these missiles aren't good or anything special. They were extremely useful in D1 and remained so in D2, but people who have played D2 only probably never developed proper respect for these missiles. I remember there even being a misconception about the Mega being nerfed in D2, even though its damage was intact (well, maybe dropped from 200 to like 198 to prevent OHKOs).

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 Post subject: Re: D1 final boss vs D2 final boss.
PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2015 7:26 pm 
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Anyone up for a coop game? Do a 1-7 run. D1?


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 Post subject: Re: D1 final boss vs D2 final boss.
PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2015 7:30 am 
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Duper wrote:
Anyone up for a coop game? Do a 1-7 run. D1?


But how to link up? Is Kali necessary?

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 Post subject: Re: D1 final boss vs D2 final boss.
PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2015 5:27 pm 
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I'd be interested, except we have a playtest for Sol Contingency this evening :twisted:
& I'm working on a new track for my concept album.

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 Post subject: Re: D1 final boss vs D2 final boss.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2015 12:30 am 
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No, almost nobody uses Kali anymore for playing multiplayer. This page is my usual go-to for a description of how it's done these days: http://descentchampions.org/new_player.php

The guide is heavily oriented towards anarchy/1v1 players, but the technology for playing co-op games is basically the same.

Edit: I forgot at least one important thing though. You don't really need Retro Mod for co-op - the peer-to-peer option is sometimes useful, but most of the tweaks are targeted at anarchy or competitive play.


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 Post subject: Re: D1 final boss vs D2 final boss.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2015 3:09 pm 
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With Rebirth, you can host a game and anyone searching should be able to find it.... assuming the correct ports on your router(s) are open and such.

Kali can be used, but isn't necessary.

Sirius, is that stuff for the Rangers mod of rebirth?..I don't have time atm to read through the page.


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 Post subject: Re: D1 final boss vs D2 final boss.
PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2015 11:11 pm 
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Not exclusively - it goes into the various methods people are using to organize games as well, which is the important part. It does mention the "Retro" mod of Rebirth - which isn't really a Rangers thing, more DCL - but the Rangers do still use it.


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 Post subject: Re: D1 final boss vs D2 final boss.
PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 1:01 am 
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Ahh.. I see. I've not used that before. Thanks!


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