2 Boarshead polymodels in rbotedit, but not when saving?

For Descent, Descent II and Descent3 level editing and modification assistance.
Post Reply
mike8887123
DBB Ace
DBB Ace
Posts: 60
Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:46 pm

2 Boarshead polymodels in rbotedit, but not when saving?

Post by mike8887123 » Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:34 pm

There are 2 boarshead models in rbotedit when using 'n' and 'p' to view the models. This makes me think I can have 2 different boarsheads (ex, one normal and one modded) in the same level. However, when go to save it (to hxm) over one of the slots, there is only one boarshead slot available to save over. I noticed that the BPER bot also has 2 models (and so do several other bots), but unlike the boarshead, the BPER also has two slots available to save over.

I looked hard at the cryptic names too. Things like "200P. Spawn" are the little hornets. I looked through the list (in rbotedit) several times in its entirety, and there is only one boarshead slot to save over.

Is there something I don't know about the naming? Perhaps its named something cryptic in rbotedit?

Thanks.
User avatar
Sirius
DBB Master
DBB Master
Posts: 5437
Joined: Fri May 28, 1999 2:01 am
Location: Bellevue, WA
Contact:

Re: 2 Boarshead polymodels in rbotedit, but not when saving?

Post by Sirius » Thu Sep 04, 2014 2:42 am

What you're seeing with the Boarshead is a "normal" polymodel and a "low-res" polymodel. There's a field in... I think the polymodel header that points to the low-res model, where it's available. Third-party missions typically don't use this feature (since it was no longer really needed once they began to incorporate custom models in 1998).

The BPER actually has multiple variants, though - the two robots have slightly different stats, as far as I recall. I don't know what the differences in usage were in the original game, but I recall that robots spawned by level bosses are quite often the variant versions.
User avatar
Xfing
DBB Admiral
DBB Admiral
Posts: 1498
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 3:03 am
Location: Ringing Satan's Doorbell

Re: 2 Boarshead polymodels in rbotedit, but not when saving?

Post by Xfing » Thu Sep 04, 2014 4:39 am

Yeah, one of them uses a dedicated sound and one recycles the sound of the PTMC Defense Prototype. Not sure what the other differences are.
Descent 1,5: Level layouts done: 34/54 Secret level layouts done: 1/6
User avatar
Alter-Fox
The Feline Menace
Posts: 2661
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 12:49 pm
Location: the realms of theory
Contact:

Re: 2 Boarshead polymodels in rbotedit, but not when saving?

Post by Alter-Fox » Thu Sep 04, 2014 7:08 am

The second one drops guided missiles, like the alternate Smelter and Omega.
I think the point of those guys is to be spawned by bosses with tweaked drops that are useful against the boss if you run out of weapons... on Brimspark and Limefrost Spiral and Tycho Brahe that makes sense at least. Actually I think that was how I beat the final boss on my Insane playthrough.
The eyes of the plush lobster stared deep into my soul. I touched it, made as if to pick it up, and then I was a panther.
BEWARE RAZZADOON'S SNOUT!!
...

Also beware my original music, at http://soundcloud.com/snowfoxden and http://vertigofox.bandcamp.com
mike8887123
DBB Ace
DBB Ace
Posts: 60
Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:46 pm

Re: 2 Boarshead polymodels in rbotedit, but not when saving?

Post by mike8887123 » Thu Sep 04, 2014 1:29 pm

So, does this mean I can't use two boarsheads in one level? Or is the header field that Sirius mentioned above something I can use? I'll look around a little harder in rbotedit next time.

Overall, its not really a problem though since I can use the regular boarshead in levels 1-2 of system 7 and use the modded (enhanced) boarshead in 3-4 of system 7. Originally, I wanted to have the enhanced boarshead appear only in 3-4 but still have the regular one in all 4. See what I mean? But if I can't use 2 in one level, then I'll do it the first way. It wasn't my plan, but its not really that bad of a compromise at all.

Polymodel variants, when used strategically, can match system themes really nicely and offer a type of within-polymodel variability. It could make the player anticipate, that is, wonder what kind of variants will appear in each next system (some like it, others think its boring repetition). As long as there are other bots that are new in each system, then it shouldn't make things too too boring. In my eyes, they did this in D1 with the brown vs red hulks, and its the concept mini-bosses revolve around too (like red fatty jr). In reality, the designers are likely recycling the same polymodel to avoid making a new one, but it has this nice side effect. So that's what I'm doing- just some background on my plans. Everything is working out pretty decently right now (except for the fact that it'll take me a year to get the entire mission done- which is the fun part though).

Anyway, thanks for the replies guys...
User avatar
Sirius
DBB Master
DBB Master
Posts: 5437
Joined: Fri May 28, 1999 2:01 am
Location: Bellevue, WA
Contact:

Re: 2 Boarshead polymodels in rbotedit, but not when saving?

Post by Sirius » Fri Sep 05, 2014 10:40 am

You can't have two Boarshead versions in the same level using the method you were imagining, but it is possible by replacing a different robot with the second Boarshead. The field I mentioned only kicks in on low detail settings in D2, where it will use the low-poly Boarshead model instead of the normal one. It won't let you use both at the same time, and it's also only a visual change.

P.S. 1 year is actually a pretty decent pace compared to most multi-level missions :)
Post Reply