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 Post subject: List of Broken Servers
PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2004 11:37 pm 
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We all know what happens to servers when they don't have time limits set on them.

So as a service to the community I've checked all the servers and am providing a list of broken servers for 2 purposes:
1. So people know not to play on them.
2. So the server ops can fix them.

[empty for now]

If you're the server op of a broken server, please put a time limit on your server and then post here to have it removed from the list. Likewise, if you're a player and you encounter a server with the typical symptoms of being on too long, check the time limit in the netgame info on the f6 menu and report the server to this thread if it lacks a time limit.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 5:51 am 
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I deleted my own servers out of your list. This is my request to delete your thread.

BROKEN? Those servers ain't broken, man.

F6 is only saying if there is a timelimit in Descent3. MY Servers (that you marked as "broken") have a timelimit via DE-Hunter's Servertool. This is a better way imho because the servers aren't only restarted, they are started NEW. I can't explain you exactly what I mean but if you would use the servertool you would know what I mean. Please DON'T refer to things you don't know enough of, Sucho.

I'd recommend to delete your post because DF.NET TseTseFly is running a script to re-start servers and I think DDevil's DF.NET LetsPlay is running on the Servertool by DE-Hunter too.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 6:19 am 
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So by only checking the timelimit in F6, A person named Suncho has determined that they are broken...

Why do I have this feeling he is going to create his own server ops board now? posts like this are a usual predictor to his actions

hey why not register a Domain too

http://www.Descentrulesbysuncho.com :wink:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 1:33 pm 
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Read that sentence again, Bubba, looks like you jumped the gun.

Most of those servers were/are indeed broken, anyway. The time limit might want to be adjusted, if it is present.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 1:56 pm 
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Do_Checkor wrote:
BROKEN? Those servers ain't broken, man.

F6 is only saying if there is a timelimit in Descent3. MY Servers (that you marked as "broken") have a timelimit via DE-Hunter's Servertool. This is a better way imho because the servers aren't only restarted, they are started NEW. I can't explain you exactly what I mean but if you would use the servertool you would know what I mean. Please DON'T refer to things you don't know enough of, Sucho.

Uhm, what is the cycle on those servers ? See, I've seen servers going nuts after as short 1hr after start (if there's a very high flux of pilots). Some of those problems fix themself after a configured time out, some can only "fixed" by a restart. It seems that it's a good idea to have BOTH, a time limit (prevents endless games too) and a restart timer..


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 2:12 pm 
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I'm glad that your server is on the up and up, Do Checkor, but it would be helpful to us players if you could put an effort in to show us that it has a time limit.

Counting intervals between laser shots, watching how the powerups spin, and gauging how my ship hovers, is not my idea of a fun time.

The first thing I do when I join a server is press f6, check the time limit, and leave if there isn't one. Perhaps a server has an invisible time limit, but I don't want to put the work in to find out. Am I the only person who does this?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 2:26 pm 
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i dont know but i sure dont

but i do agree, with suncho becuse sometimes its so bad people that are not even in the game appear as playing


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 4:42 am 
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in my whole D3 carrier in 4 years I had about 10-20 times the problem with servers that gone nuts because of no timelimit. I didn't meant to say "hey people - DON'T put a timelimit" - I wanted to say, that it would be very nice not to write servernames because you THINK they COULD go nuts because of something. AND the DF.NET Servers aren't all from the same op and on the same machine. I mailed DDevil and Coolchris and as far as I understood they weren't very thankful for your post with their servernames because they spend A LOT of time and work with keeping their servers good and clean and HAVE a timelimt. The same is with me and my Servers...

Server-restarts of under 3 hours seem to be VERY annoying to players. The first year of Descentforum.net I had 60 min. timelimit. People came onto the server and after the timelimt restarted the server all were gone (I watched this plenty times). So the effect WITH a too much "paranoid" timelimt can be the opposite...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2004 2:32 pm 
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Well maybe you play on different servers than I do. It got to the point where every day I'd join a server that had problems. I'd either not be able to shoot or have super rapid fire weapons. Sometimes I couldn't even respawn. All of these problems can be solved by a time limit. You don't actually have to restart the server.

Certain other problems can only be fixed by a restart (eg. names of players who aren't in the game) but none of them are critical to gameplay.

I apologize if I've offended any server ops I've offended, but I wouldn't go about it any other way. I could spend the extra time tracking down each server op and contacting them individually, but I'm just a player and I want to play the game I love without doing a ton of research.

The amount of servers that actually are messed up is unacceptable to me as a player. It almost makes me not want to play D3 anymore.


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 Post subject: Re: List of Broken Servers
PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 5:21 pm 
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Suncho wrote:
We all know what happens to servers when they don't have time limits set on them.

So as a service to the community I've checked all the servers and am providing a list of broken servers for 2 purposes:
1. So people know not to play on them.
2. So the server ops can fix them.

Houston Express
Over The Hill Gang
Roadkills Subway
Stadium 50 kills
[GTW]Descent 3 Server
[NT]Server #1

If you're the server op of a broken server, please put a time limit on your server and then post here to have it removed from the list. Likewise, if you're a player and you encounter a server with the typical symptoms of being on too long, check the time limit in the netgame info on the f6 menu and report the server to this thread if it lacks a time limit.

Not having a time limit doesn't mean the server's broke. "Over The Hill Gang" Gets restarted manually every four to six hours. Time limits inhibit play. It is the servers option to put time limits or not.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2004 9:28 am 
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Well I know for the fact that Over The Hill Gang is broken because I've joined it many times and not been able to shoot or respawn.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2004 8:14 pm 
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This one seems to be broken too:
RC's #06 FT20 66.93.9.236:2093

I can never connect to it. Right now it's instareap! It seems to randomly dissapear from the list quite often.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2004 4:59 am 
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This list is for servers that are broken once you get in.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2004 5:01 am 
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Added another server to the list: DF.NET - TseTseFly 1.

It's definitely broken. I just tried playing in there.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2004 9:23 am 
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What is going on here? Suncho said "hey heads up, these servers have the time limit bug on them..." And you jump down on him like he punched your wife and kicked your dog. Chill out a bit, cant someone post a little helpful bit mentioning a sometimes overlooked but well known bug and not get all sorts of angry replys in the process? If suncho says the server is having this problem (which I have seen many times) then I believe him, and if I were running a server and saw it on his list I would move to correct the problem immedately and thank him for pointing it out.

Sheesh, never leave a good deed unpunished, is that what the serverops run by today? :roll:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2004 10:50 am 
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If anyone see's Spooty's server go funky (before I do ;)) and doesn't have his email, tell me and I'll tell him. It's the [NT] server.


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 Post subject: Re: List of Broken Servers
PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2004 3:04 pm 
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@ Krom:

American Spirit wrote:
Time limits inhibit play. It is the servers option to put time limits or not.


I agree A.S. To restart a server 10 times a day is bullshit and no solving of the problem - it just makes other probs (people leave because of those very annoying server restarts)...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 14, 2004 2:50 pm 
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Added the 2 1v1.descent.cx indika servers.

I tried to play a D3L match there today but couldn't.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2004 10:18 pm 
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Added: Descent Retirement Home


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2004 5:47 am 
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I've always set my servers to restart every 3 to 6 hours (via the TimeLimit parameter in the cfg file). Also, the servers were stopped and restarted completely every 24 hours (it might need this 'cold restart' to be done every 12??).

The ghost players aren't really a problem unless in a team game (i.e. can't determine even teams via f7). But the other bugs are terrible.

I would much rather see the TimeLimit set. And then do cold restarts less often. This is because the cold restarts force you out of the game instead of just resetting stats.

hmmm.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2004 1:36 pm 
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Yep me too. The side effects of not doing a cold restart are negligible. Just set a time limit and let the server run forever.

EDIT: 6 hours is too long by the way. Should be 3 hours or less.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2004 7:00 pm 
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Restarts via TimeLimit or KillGoal do not fix ghost players. I've experienced this plenty of times.

Only completely stopping and restarting the server will fix this... exactly what Hunter's proggy does.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2004 11:10 pm 
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Right. I'm saying I don't care about ghost players.

I care about being able to shoot and being able to respawn.

If a server has five hundred million ghost players on it then I don't care. I just want to be able to play normally.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 6:16 am 
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The ghost players get in the way sometimes.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:58 am 
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i've NEVER had the experiance of not being able to shoot, and not being able to spawn. Is that something only suncho has experianced, or am i just special enough not to have to worry about that.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:24 am 
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I ran into it once with a halcyon server... Everyone had super-rapid-fire lasers that did 100 damage except for like 3 people, who couldn't respawn for a full minute after dying, and couldn't shoot after respawning. The flags, of course, were totally screwed; only 1 person from each team could pick up the flag.

Hey... I just got an idea for a new gametype... Hmm...

:lol: :evil: :twisted:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:54 am 
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Zer0Cool wrote:
i've NEVER had the experiance of not being able to shoot, and not being able to spawn. Is that something only suncho has experianced, or am i just special enough not to have to worry about that.


You must have only played on servers recently started or restarted.

Stryker... no need for a new game type... you already got it. :lol:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:23 pm 
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Info for all:

D3Server has an option in the "Global Settings" where you can set a "automatic restart of all servers". The tool checks after XXX minutes if anybody is playing - if there is nobody it will quit the server and start again. If there are people playing, it will wait till it is empty...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 8:36 am 
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Added Descentforum.NET 2. Just tried playing there and it had the bug.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:04 am 
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...and still 5 people in there are playing and have fun and don't even notice what you call "broken"...

I mean: You are right: After now 5,5h alive, the server has some very calm effects of the bug but I just checked it and noticed: Only Pro's will even notice it...

However - I told you my point in chat already...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 5:37 pm 
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I've hashed this out enough at the serverops forum.
I checked the data base on my servers and your Pilot/IP show up very few times.
"The Over The Hill Gang Server" is not broken. I restart it manually, all the usual players request no time limit. The players can use their own judgement on whether to play in a server or not. You're whining over a temporary problem on all the servers you've listed, because they don't suite your personal preferences. To list them as broken is bogus. The answer is simple. You don't have to play on any of them. You've no authority to list any of them as "broken". Set up your own servers and set them as you see fit.
I have polled my regular players (of which you're not one, under any of your alias or IP's) and they prefer no time limit. They know the servers are well maintained and offer a good game with problems of the type you speak of being the exception and not the rule.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 5:49 pm 
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Just one more thing Suncho.
For someone who "Helped Hunter" write his tool, I'd expect you to have a better clue as to how it works :)


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 Post subject: Check your facts :)
PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 6:26 pm 
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Suncho wrote:
Well I know for the fact that Over
The Hill Gang is broken because I've joined it many times and not been able to shoot or respawn.


OK, one more thing again :)

The fact is, you haven't been on any of my servers long enough (I checked the data base, both pilot and IP address) to form any REAL opinion of them.
It's obvious that you come in, hit F6, then leave when you see no time limit.
You need to find a game you can have more actual FUN in :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 6:40 pm 
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Krom wrote:
What is going on here? Suncho said "hey heads up, these servers have the time limit bug on them..." And you jump down on him like he punched your wife and kicked your dog. Chill out a bit, cant someone post a little helpful bit mentioning a sometimes overlooked but well known bug and not get all sorts of angry replys in the process? If suncho says the server is having this problem (which I have seen many times) then I believe him, and if I were running a server and saw it on his list I would move to correct the problem immedately and thank him for pointing it out.

Sheesh, never leave a good deed unpunished, is that what the serverops run by today? :roll:


Putting out a list of servers as "Broken" in a public forum, is not just saying "hey, heads up."
He wants his personal preference on all servers and is neglecting other options, such as the autorestart in the D3 server tool, or coming back to the server later to see if the problem was temporary, which in almost all cases, it is.
There were no attempts prior to the list to contact any of the server ops to discuss what he perseeves as a serious problem, when in fact it is a self resolving issue, as a server that is really that screwed up, will usually crash and have to be restarted anyway :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 5:54 am 
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Forget it American Spirit!

I was on your Server with him, and I was on MY Server with him. In fact the bug happend when we were on them. But in fact the server was NOT broken, only the firing rates was a VERY little different from beeing TOTALLY 100% okay - but it was totally playable. I asked another player (no newbie) in the Server if he sees ANY problem with the server and he answered "no - everything is just fine" and that's the point:

Suncho - stop calling ANY Server as "broken" wich has no visible timelimt set or has slightly different firing-rates. Let the PLAYERS and SERVEROPS decide if it is okay or not and stop annoying with this. Every player can decide himself - they don't need a Suncho who seems to do nothing else then foing on servers to check timelimits or firing rates!

Here is a statistic-pic from my Server Descentforum.NET and TseTseFly with went at THAT time you called it "broken":

Image

You call it "broken" and the players called it "fun at playing". So stop it! Some ops asked me you kill your topics and one even asked me to ban you from the Ops-Board and I start understanding THEIR point aswell.

esa intended, that he has a 2h timelimit - but his server is / was on your lists too.

EVERY ServerOp understood your point months ago but it is NOT your decision, and like A.S. said not your authority to tell the Ops what to do or set. I moved a topic of Bubbalou months ago into the Settings-board in the ServerOps-Board, wich contained info about timelimts.

Now it is enough, man. Do us a favour and delete this topic...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:40 am 
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Do_Checkor wrote:
Suncho - stop calling ANY Server as "broken" wich has no visible timelimt set or has slightly different firing-rates.


I've never done that. I only call a server broken if I have a problem with it that can be attributed to the time limit bug and THEN I check the time limit as a verification.

Do_Checkor wrote:
Let the PLAYERS and SERVEROPS decide if it is okay or not and stop annoying with this.


I am a player. I'm deciding for myself that certain servers are broken. Nobody is requiring to listen, but I will continue to argue because I want to play on most of these servers.

Do_Checkor wrote:
Every player can decide himself - they don't need a Suncho who seems to do nothing else then foing on servers to check timelimits or firing rates!


I have neither the time nor the desire to go around policing servers. I just report problems that prevent me from playing as I encounter them.

American Spirit wrote:
Just one more thing Suncho.
For someone who "Helped Hunter" write his tool, I'd expect you to have a better clue as to how it works


I know that it only resets the server if there aren't players in it. If there are players in your server for more than 4 hours straight, that's a problem.

American Spirit wrote:
The fact is, you haven't been on any of my servers long enough (I checked the data base, both pilot and IP address) to form any REAL opinion of them.


The fact is that I would play on your servers more if they didn't have the time limit bug. The fact is that I have had the respawn problem on your server in the past year. If it gets to the point where people can't even respawn, I consider it a problem. Other players can formulate their own opinions.

American Spirit wrote:
He wants his personal preference on all servers and is neglecting other options, such as the autorestart in the D3 server tool, or coming back to the server later to see if the problem was temporary, which in almost all cases, it is.


Autorestart is a nice feature but it doesn't solve the time limit problem.

Of course the problem is temporary. But if I want to play at a certain time and the server is broken at that time, that's not very helpful to me, is it?

American Spirit wrote:
There were no attempts prior to the list to contact any of the server ops to discuss what he perseeves as a serious problem, when in fact it is a self resolving issue, as a server that is really that screwed up, will usually crash and have to be restarted anyway


Of course there weren't. As I said before, I have neither the time nor the desire to go around policing servers. If I have a problem, I'll post it in the forums. I'm not going to write down email addresses from MOTDs.

Do_Checkor wrote:
esa intended, that he has a 2h timelimit - but his server is / was on your lists too.


Are you calling me a liar? I tried to play a D3L match in those servers and both I and my opponent agreed that they were unplayable because of the time limit bug. Maybe he forgot to put a time limit on his 1on1 servers or something.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:41 am 
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DBB Defender
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Website: http://www.suncho.com
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Location: Richmond, VT
Removed Descentforum.NET 2. Thanks Checkor!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 8:59 pm 
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Suncho wrote:
I know that it only resets the server if there aren't players in it. If there are players in your server for more than 4 hours straight, that's a problem.


If the players are there for that long (and it happens a lot, yes, because unlike you, most are there for the fun and not to check time limits :) ) then I'd say it was a fun, playable game. When they all leave, it resets. End of the time bug problem.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 9:11 pm 
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Do_Checkor wrote:
Forget it American Spirit!


Believe me Do_Checkor, it's forgotten, I've made my last post to him :)
Like I said, the reason the server is called "Over The Hill Gang." is because the players are mostly vetrans of Descent since it's conception.
He's out voted at least 25 to 1 there as to the time bug being any problem at all. Like you, I would request he delete the string and maybe open up a new one on the time bug as he sees it :)
Thanks for your input on my server and your opinion that it's not broken.

And to the Newbies seeing this string, Don't let one whiner that needs the game to be perfect to play, scare you off any of his list of "Broken" servers.
They're not. The bug does exist, but all serverops do their best to keep it under control.
Usually, if everyone leaves, the server is due for a reset and will do it automatically when everyone's gone.
Then just come back and continue the fun :)


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 11:42 pm 
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Location: Richmond, VT
American Spirit wrote:
If the players are there for that long (and it happens a lot, yes, because unlike you, most are there for the fun and not to check time limits :) ) then I'd say it was a fun, playable game.


You know I don't join games to check time limits. I really don't appreciate you speaking about me like that. You'd be surprised at the horrible state of the game I've seen people play in. One time I was in stadium and people were playing. So I just sat in observer mode to watch how they'd react to the bug. Some players sould join and not be able to shoot and leave. Some players would complain when they couldn't respawn as if they hadn't noticed any problems before it happened. But invariably, the game kept going... and going... and going...

American Spirit wrote:
When they all leave, it resets. End of the time bug problem.


So we all have to leave the game at once and rejoin? What if some lamer decides to stay on the server and ruin it for everyone? What if someone who just doesn't "get it" stays in the server and unintentionally ruins the game for everyone? Wouldn't it be easier for everyone involved if you just set a time limit?


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