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 Post subject: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 10:54 am 
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It's truly sickening to see left wingers and democrats try to capitalize on a mass murder to push an agenda and gain political advantage.

"You never let a serious crisis go to waste. And what I mean by that it's an opportunity to do things you think you could not do before." Rahm Emanuel said...and it's something that leftists take to heart. Chaos and mayhem seem to be their political life blood.

What is little more than leftist propaganda is being shoved into "comedy" and "entertainment" ever more brazenly:

http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/03/late- ... ing-video/

https://news.grabien.com/story-montage- ... -blame-gop

It's happened repeatedly. Sandy Hook was also used in the same way:


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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 10:57 am 
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Yes, how dare people push for sane laws after a despicable act due in no small part to the insane laws that one party espouses!


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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 10:59 am 
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Top Gun wrote:
Yes, how dare people push for sane laws after a despicable act due in no small part to the insane laws that one party espouses!


How dare democrats and leftist "entertainers" (propagandists) stand on the still warm bodies of the murder victims to push a political agenda?

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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 1:48 pm 
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because when the bodies are warm seems like the only time some of you pay any attention. The rest of the time you are making lame excuses about false equvalencies. Remember the times nitwits here have asked me why I don't support knife bans?

this speaks to that one, but also the entire myopia:
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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 3:19 pm 
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Nightshade wrote:

How dare democrats and leftist "entertainers" (propagandists) stand on the still warm bodies of the murder victims to push a political agenda?


I'm willing to bet that most of the friends and family of all those shooting victims from the last decade or 2 would gladly join the Dems in their fight too, because like it or not, gun control has become a political hot potato deserving of it's own agenda.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/newtown-fa ... n-control/

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/san ... -1.2593803

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lonnie-an ... 97804.html

So you can't blame the liberals and those families of shooting victims for at least trying to change the deadly status quo. However, it doesn't mean that they will ever be successful in this country if the past is any indication. :wink:

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... as/541692/

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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 4:41 pm 
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Yea, who the fuck cares why the society keeps producing these murderers, lets just get gun control, and everything will be ok.

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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 5:50 pm 
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Hey stop crying crocodile tears as we know you libs don't give a shit since it was rednecks that were killed:

Quote:
Hayley Geftman-Gold, a VP and senior counsel in strategic transactions at CBS wrote on Facebook Monday just hours after a shooting in Las Vegas at a country-music festival left at least 58 dead and hundreds more injured, “If they wouldn’t do anything when children were murdered I have no hope that Repugs will ever do the right thing. I’m actually not even sympathetic bc country music fans are often republican gun toters.”


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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 6:20 pm 
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And all the Republicans ever do bow down to the NRA and kiss their collective asses. I don't see them coming up with a serious solution other than to tell us that we just need to arm more people, even those not mentally fit to own a gun. I'm not against the Second Amendment and I own guns and enjoy shooting them for recreation, but we need something other than this free-for-all shooting gallery we have now. Hell, I'm even afraid of flipping off some motorist who cuts me off for fear of getting shot nowadays since so many people are carrying. Yes, the liberals always knee jerk after one of these episodes. Yes, they're using it as a political wedge issue. And yes, it's the same old saw. You'd think they'd learn. And every time they do it, Republicans collectively stand their ground and war cry that no one will ever take away their freedom to own guns. Naa, naa, naa. But I guarantee you, your fears are unfounded. We'll never see the day that the liberals, or anyone else, will be able to take away everyone's guns, because it just isn't possible. This country loves it's guns, to death.

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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 9:15 pm 
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Nightshade wrote:
How dare democrats and leftist "entertainers" (propagandists) stand on the still warm bodies of the murder victims to push a political agenda?

Speaking out now is not only appropriate, it's necessary, since one party apparently doesn't give a flying fuck about mass murders so long as they get to keep fellating their metal dicks. When politicians have the balls to stand up to the NRA's satanic bullshit, and Wayne LaPierre and his ilk are joyfully roasting in hell, maybe then you'd have a point. But until that day comes someone needs to speak for sanity.

woodchip wrote:
Hey stop crying crocodile tears as we know you libs don't give a shit since it was rednecks that were killed:

"Hi I'm woody and one stupid asshole speaks for everyone of a certain political persuasion because I don't have the critical thinking skills to maintain a sense of perspective!"


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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:29 am 
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What's sickening is that Kimmel almost sounds giddy for the first few seconds before breaking into his sobbing act. The guy can turn the tears on and off at will. I'll give him that.

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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 4:27 am 
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Ah yes, couldn't let an opportunity pass to post more of that blithering idiot Shapiro's scintillating drivel.


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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 6:14 am 
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sad commentary on Ben's intellect when a talk show host runs logical circles around him, and he's too stupid to realize. NS, I'm used to that, but Ben?

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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 6:34 am 
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I love NS' line of reasoning:

I guess when planes hit at 9/11 that we should have waited to be respectful for the dead? The argument that 'gun control' would never stop such a killing has to be the most ludicrous claim I've ever heard, on this example. Gee, if it was a 10 year mandatory to possess a doctored stock and another 10 years mandatory and loss of all commercial licensure to sell one to someone, I'm guessing these wouldn't be available on the Internet for long, or at least not at a crazy price. If we hadn't lifted the assault weapons ban, we could at least have had such incidents at the 1/3 the rate, which we had prior to allowing it to lapse. If we capped the number of weapons that could be registered to anyone for personal possession, and put legal teeth behind the limit, this wouldn't happen. If we were even able to know which nuts are out there sitting on 43 weapons, that would help, too. Oh, I can hear the paranoid loons saying,"I don't want a government to know about my weapons stash, in case I may need to mount an insurrection and America fuck yeah". This is a stupid assertion. No one, even a nut with 50 guns, is going to last an hour against the government forces, if it really matters. This guy didn't even TRY to hold off the government forces(cops). No, the ONLY purpose of the current laws is around allowing people to acquire more weapons(benefitting the trade group that encourages such purchases), and the SOLE purpose of doing so is to allow an individual the potential of slaying large numbers of fellow citizens. Fuck that, it's time for a change, and NOW, I am ready to see the entire matter of the obsolete 2nd amendment go away, as we clearly do not have the societal maturity to deal with it. We should go to the Switzerland model, where you can own weapons, but the ammo has to be in a state monitored stash, and no one can fire a gun without extensive training and periodic training tests.

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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 7:11 am 
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from Borowitz:I'm confused: how is respectful to people who died in a tragedy to not discuss preventing other people from dying in future tragedies?




why is it that Ben Shapiro can't find the morality and intellect to accept such logic?

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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:05 am 
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Right wingers sought to invade Iraq after 9/11, so you can shut the fuck up if you're trying to say this is a left winger phenomenon.


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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:44 am 
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one nitwit attempted to use a shoe bomb and I'm STILL taking my fucking shoes off every time I fly someplace.

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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 12:57 pm 
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Another fun sign of how fucked we are: the federal database of firearm transactions is located in West Virginia and consists of Lord knows how many boxes of PAPER FILES. The facility has a few storage containers rented because they can't fit all of them in the building proper. Oh, and these are just the records from defunct gun shops: active stores have to keep them on the premises themselves. Oh, and I didn't mention the fact that they aren't legally able to digitize these records in any fashion that would allow them to be electronically searched, because "Dat gubmint gonna take away mah gunz!" They have to keep most of them on FUCKING MICROFILM. Only recently could they start using (again, non-searchable) PDFs. So when a law enforcement trace request comes in, some poor schmuck has to dig through mountains of paper, because fuck basic common sense.

This is America: land of the paranoid, home of the fuckwitted.


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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 3:28 pm 
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I wouldn't single that out. The VA's got a similar problem, and STILL does even after all the snarky politicians, from both parties, keep standing up and promising us they're going to fix it by throwing tons of money at the problem, for all the good it's done so far.

Image

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/vet ... a-staff-1/

https://www.publicintegrity.org/2013/08 ... te-records

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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 4:19 pm 
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Top Gun wrote:
Another fun sign of how fucked we are: the federal database of firearm transactions is located in West Virginia and consists of Lord knows how many boxes of PAPER FILES. The facility has a few storage containers rented because they can't fit all of them in the building proper. Oh, and these are just the records from defunct gun shops: active stores have to keep them on the premises themselves. Oh, and I didn't mention the fact that they aren't legally able to digitize these records in any fashion that would allow them to be electronically searched, because "Dat gubmint gonna take away mah gunz!" They have to keep most of them on FUCKING MICROFILM. Only recently could they start using (again, non-searchable) PDFs. So when a law enforcement trace request comes in, some poor schmuck has to dig through mountains of paper, because fuck basic common sense.


That's the feds for you. Making the records electronically available would be a de-facto registration which the feds are not allowed to have. States are free to implement them if they so wish (and get it past their people, eg. CA, NY etc.) In OR the background check has to go through the state police and the records are held for 5 to 7 years electronically w/ them.

What do you think a registration database would do better than the current system ?

For the curious:

Quote:
FFL holders are required to keep a registry of firearms sales in an ATF-approved Bound Book, or a computerized equivalent using ATF-approved software. Licensed dealers must also maintain file copies of Form 4473 or eForm 4473 "Firearms Transaction Record" documents, for a period of not less than 20 years after the date of sale or disposition. When retiring or otherwise relinquishing a license, these records are sent to the ATF's Out-of-Business Records Center. Licensed collectors are not required to send their records to the ATF when relinquishing their license. The ATF is allowed to inspect, as well as request a copy of the Form 4473 from the dealer during the course of a criminal investigation. In addition, the sale of two or more handguns to a person in a five business day period must be reported to ATF on Form 3310.4.


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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 7:35 pm 
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Grendel wrote:
That's the feds for you. Making the records electronically available would be a de-facto registration which the feds are not allowed to have. States are free to implement them if they so wish (and get it past their people, eg. CA, NY etc.) In OR the background check has to go through the state police and the records are held for 5 to 7 years electronically w/ them.

And why the hell not? In what sort of ridiculously ass-backwards society do we live that federal law enforcement shouldn't be able to check up on people who own objects solely designed to, y'know, kill other people? The 2nd Amendment as written does not have one iota of application to modern society. It is a ridiculous vestigial remnant of a time when the most powerful weaponry had garbage accuracy at 50 yards and could be fired at no more than 2 rounds per minute, a time when a significant percentage of the population were subsistence hunters. It's the 21st century. It has no place here without massive revision.

Quote:
What do you think a registration database would do better than the current system ?

Well gee, I dunno, maybe enable law enforcement to see that some potential shithead nutjob suddenly starts stockpiling enough AR-15s to occupy Paris? Or being able to swiftly track who sold firearms to criminals, and whether they should have done so? Or maybe just having the bare semblance of a modern-day database system?

Seriously, read the article. Tell me that isn't fucking absurd.

(Again: four times as many gun stores as McDonald's. What the literal fuck.)


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 Post subject: Re: "You never let a serious crisis go to waste"
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:56 pm 
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Top Gun wrote:
Grendel wrote:
That's the feds for you. Making the records electronically available would be a de-facto registration which the feds are not allowed to have. States are free to implement them if they so wish (and get it past their people, eg. CA, NY etc.) In OR the background check has to go through the state police and the records are held for 5 to 7 years electronically w/ them.

And why the hell not? In what sort of ridiculously ass-backwards society do we live that federal law enforcement shouldn't be able to check up on people who own objects solely designed to, y'know, kill other people? The 2nd Amendment as written does not have one iota of application to modern society. It is a ridiculous vestigial remnant of a time when the most powerful weaponry had garbage accuracy at 50 yards and could be fired at no more than 2 rounds per minute, a time when a significant percentage of the population were subsistence hunters. It's the 21st century. It has no place here without massive revision.


Gee wiz. Guns are designed to project force. It's up to the user what to do with them, be it killing, threatening, target practice, making artwork, hammering nails, you name it. As usual, all actions have consequences so act wisely. In my lifetime I have been mugged at knife point, have been assaulted w/o reason (ever feared for your life while being helpless ? It's a sobering experience), and I have seen my share of nasty fights out of the blue. Currently there's a drug house down my road and quite a few meth heads in the area (24/7 laundry). I learned the hard way that there is no way that the police can protect me if someone decides to take what I own or that I don't deserve to live. So unless social progress catches up w/ our technological progress I'm glad that the 2nd protects my right to self defense by giving me the option to legally own a very effective deterrent.

As for your "powerful weapons" stats, you may want to look a little closer into that. Being the technological progressives of their time the founding fathers were well aware of what was out there and where technology was headed. Rifled barrels date back to the 15. century, same as multi-shot weapons. Check out Forgotten Weapons, informative and entertaining.

https://www.forgottenweapons.com/ria-lo ... lintlocks/
http://www.nramuseum.com/the-museum/the ... lock.aspx#
https://www.forgottenweapons.com/puckle-gun-video/

Top Gun wrote:
Quote:
What do you think a registration database would do better than the current system ?

Well gee, I dunno, maybe enable law enforcement to see that some potential shithead nutjob suddenly starts stockpiling enough AR-15s to occupy Paris?

So, when does someone becomes a "potential shithead nutjob" ? By buying guns ? Remember, he passed the criminal background check.

Top Gun wrote:
Or being able to swiftly track who sold firearms to criminals, and whether they should have done so? Or maybe just having the bare semblance of a modern-day database system?

Doesn't matter if it takes a few hours or days tracing a gun, the seller will be found if he bought the gun legally in the 1st place and the crooks didn't mess w/ the serial numbers -- most of the time the traceable owner had his gun stolen from him though. Dead end. Personally I'm perfectly fine w/ the archaic system, it works and it's very hard to abuse (like a database most certainly will be -- registration, profiling, you name it.) Once society progress catches up, go for the database and add at least knifes and kinetic tools.

Top Gun wrote:
Seriously, read the article. Tell me that isn't fucking absurd.

(Again: four times as many gun stores as McDonald's. What the literal fuck.)

Have to take that 4x number w/ a grain of salt -- it's the amount of FFL's, this includes C&R licenses and manufacturers (eg. gunsmiths) The amount of actual retail gun stores is probably a lot lower (eg. there's one store in my area but 10+ FFL's)

Edit: an interesting sub-title line from that article: "Information Is Power"...


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