Enterprise: The Council

Cougar · Post by **Cougar** » Wed May 12, 2004 7:42 pm

Great episode. Damnit I'm going to kill someone if that show gets canned next season...

[spoiler]So how bout that? Degra gets the hit put on him and Hoshi gets abducted..[/spoiler]

Capm · Post by **Capm** » Wed May 12, 2004 9:11 pm

Only one thing bothers me about Enterprise. You know the outcome of the whole situation already, otherwise, the events in all the other star trek series would never have happened.

Jon the Great · Post by **Jon the Great** » Wed May 12, 2004 10:56 pm

Definately one of the better episodes this season.

Capm wrote:Only one thing bothers me about Enterprise. You know the outcome of the whole situation already, otherwise, the events in all the other star trek series would never have happened.

Not when they mess with time.

Which, I'd like to point out, they've been doing every season like clockwork.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Thu May 13, 2004 1:21 pm

Amazing episode. 10 out of 10. This is exactly what this show needs to insure its return next season.

[spoiler]I'll admit that I did get a little upset at Degra's death; he's been a great character, and I was beginning to get attached to him. Both Hoshi and Travis got some more airtime. Speaking of Hoshi, it looks as though she'll be in for a rough time next week. I hope they don't write her off, though; she definitely has room for growth and development.[/spoiler]

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Thu May 13, 2004 2:20 pm

Looks like its gonna get canned. Ratings are very low, and Berman is practically begging Paramount not to can it according to Scifi News.

btw, cut out the warez talk. If you want to chit chat about downloading, do it over PMs or instant messaging.

JMEaT · Post by **JMEaT** » Thu May 13, 2004 4:12 pm

Yeah, I have heard the rumors of the show being canned. I hope not, it is such a nice series. A lot better than Voyager.

Cougar · Post by **Cougar** » Fri May 14, 2004 10:49 am

I don't think it's going to be canned, how's that for a bit of healthy optimism?

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Fri May 14, 2004 10:51 am

Cougar wrote:I don't think it's going to be canned, how's that for a bit of healthy optimism?

not good news for Ent fans...if there are any left

[spoiler]Good riddance to bad rubbish I say.

[/spoiler]

JMEaT · Post by **JMEaT** » Fri May 14, 2004 1:46 pm

MD-2389 wrote:Good riddance to bad rubbish I say.

Beats the ★■◆● outta Babylon 5...

woodchip · Post by **woodchip** » Fri May 14, 2004 1:49 pm

Since the cable SciFi station picked it up along with Adromeda...there should be continuing episodes (I hope)

Cougar · Post by **Cougar** » Fri May 14, 2004 2:39 pm

JMEaT wrote:
MD-2389 wrote:Good riddance to bad rubbish I say.
Beats the **** outta Babylon 5...

Beats the **** outta most (if not all) sci-fi dramas.

Top Wop · Post by **Top Wop** » Fri May 14, 2004 4:33 pm

The recent Enterprise episodes have been really good. THis recent one was the damn best. Unfortunately it was not like that all the time. Enterprise all along has been a real sleeper sans a few episodes here and there, so its no surprise where its heading. That and not allot of people watch UPN. Mayby it would be better if it was shown on CBS? Who knows. (CBS is the parent company of UPN).

As for the movies, the last one had bad marketing and lost to some really good movies. It was bad timing for the release. Plus that break they had of 4 years actually hurt the franchise more than helped it. People just lost interest.

IMO Berman and Braga should leave and Paramount should hand it over to someone who has fresh ideas, because the time travel card can only be played so many times until it becomes an excuse for a plot hole/dead end. That and appealing to sex with their resident whore is only going to shut off their younger audiences (like thats gonna help their ratings! :rolleyes: ).

If Star Trek is gonna last, something dramatic has to happen and it has to be done now. It is a very popular and robust franchise and shutting it down isnt the answer. Frankly it is the only sci-fi series I will ever be interested in.

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Fri May 14, 2004 11:08 pm

JMEaT wrote:
MD-2389 wrote:Good riddance to bad rubbish I say.
Beats the **** outta Babylon 5...

Hmm, a dying show beats another show that actually HAS continuity, an actual fanbase, aliens that DON'T all speak english, and...oh yeah an actual overal story with a feature film in the works! Riiiiight.

Seriously though, this may be why Enterprise is getting the boot

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Sat May 15, 2004 12:14 pm

Woot woot, I'm actually wondering what this next generation of shows will be like. However, I once saw something about the Star Trek Excelsier (not sure if that's how you speel it

) being a show? I wanted to see Sulu again! WAAAAAAAH!! Oh well. Anyway, I do hope at least this show continues though.

Babylon 5 I watched for 15 minutes once. Then I shut it off.

Enterprise: I watched it a good 5 episodes or more, then I shut it off when they started to visit the local ho shop. Then I turned it back on when they weren't in the ho shop.

Top Wop · Post by **Top Wop** » Sat May 15, 2004 1:05 pm

Wow, that info you post MD is interesting. Its nice to see from the B&B company that they are at least TRYING to re-live Gene's vision, and kudos to them for listening to the fans. Question is now how well will they do it. Their track record is not stellar.

Honestly id rather see "Excelsior" than anything else, but if I read correctly from a long time ago UPN was saying no.

So if we can get rid of bad rubbish and replace it with something much better, its win-win and im all for it, though I have a suspicion that his job is on the line (only NOW is he listening to the fans?). A poor movie, a series slipping in ratings. Yeap. Paramount is shopping around for a new executive producer. Right now its strike two.

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Sat May 15, 2004 3:28 pm

Personally I didn't think the last ST movie was THAT bad. It was much better then Insurrection ever was. It atleast had that movie feel and not just a "hour and half bonus TNG episode" feel.

Needless to say it still wasn't quite on the scale of First Contact. They really need to find a new network to be successful IMO.

When you're on a network with lineups that consist of shows like...

All of Us, the family comedy based loosely on Will Smith's life. Duane Martin stars.
The Opposite Sex, a romantic comedy about twentysomethings, led by singer Eve.
Rock Me Baby, starring Dan Cortese as a young shock-radio DJ forced to grow up as a new father.
TheMullets, a male-buddy comedy starring Michael Weaver and David Hornsby as brothers who work as roofers. With Loni Anderson.
Jake 2.0, UPN's lone new drama, about a National Security Agency worker who turns into a superhero after being accidentally injected with computer chips.

As well as all the other steaming piles of crap shows they have, it doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out UPN really isn't in your best interests.

Then again B&B haven't exactly been the sharpest knives in the drawer.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Sat May 15, 2004 3:44 pm

I've been reading the Enterprise message board at Startrek.com. It's actually pretty interesting. An industry insider, who was largely behind a large letter-writing campaign to Les Mooves at CBS, has a gut feeling that Enterprise will not be back at UPN next year. However, he is almost positive that Enterprise will be back, most likely at UPN. Head over there and check out some of the discussions. I especially liked his one post: "In twenty years, people will still know about Star Trek, but no one will remember UPN." Die, scum

.

Avder · Post by **Avder** » Sat May 15, 2004 9:53 pm

woodchip wrote:Since the cable SciFi station picked it up along with Adromeda...there should be continuing episodes (I hope)

Wait...Sci-Fi is picking up Enterprise?

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Sat May 15, 2004 10:45 pm

No, Enterprise is definitely not going to SciFi, at least not now. Thank God for that, at least

.

Sup · Post by **Sup** » Sun May 16, 2004 11:06 am

Berman and Braga ended up wrecking Trek. Too much drama, not enough real sci-fi - exploration of the unknown:

How about real aliens (ie things you can barely imagine) rather than "everyone you meet being humans with rubber prosthetics"

IMO Enterprise is the end result of that watering down. But I havent seen it lately, you guys could be seeing something I havent.

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Sun May 16, 2004 8:03 pm

mob-messenger wrote:Woot woot, I'm actually wondering what this next generation of shows will be like. However, I once saw something about the Star Trek Excelsier (not sure if that's how you speel it ) being a show? I wanted to see Sulu again! WAAAAAAAH!! Oh well. Anyway, I do hope at least this show continues though.

You're not the only one that wants to see Sulu finally get his own show.

Babylon 5 I watched for 15 minutes once. Then I shut it off.

You missed the best stuff dude, including the Shadow war and Earth Civil War. Look up the blooper reels atleast.

Enterprise: I watched it a good 5 episodes or more, then I shut it off when they started to visit the local ho shop. Then I turned it back on when they weren't in the ho shop.

As much as I hated the idea of "Enterprise", I decided to give it a fair shot. I watched it from the very beginning to that episode with the vulcans caught spying on the andorians. I couldn't bare to watch anymore due to the sheer bad acting (not the fault of the actors, but the abysmal writing staff...and the fact that B&B told them to act as its written and ONLY as its written.) so found something else to watch instead.

Cougar · Post by **Cougar** » Sun May 16, 2004 9:14 pm

You call that a fair run?
The cool babylon 5 epics didn't start until around the third season. Rewatch the Next Generation episodes from the first two seasons. Very few were any good at all. It takes a while for the writing staff and the actors to loosen up. You should give Season 3 an honest run for it's money. It's not perfect but it's good television.

Cougar · Post by **Cougar** » Sun May 16, 2004 9:19 pm

mob-messenger wrote: Enterprise: I watched it a good 5 episodes or more, then I shut it off when they started to visit the local ho shop. Then I turned it back on when they weren't in the ho shop.

Do you even realize there's a story behind all of the T'Pol developments? There's a great moral parallel with T'Pols adoption of Trellium-D to evoke a controllable state of emotion to the excessive use (and abuse) of modern pharmacuticals people use to cope with modern society. Hit home for me. You're too wrapped up in the SEXUALITY (not 'ho shop', how juvenille..) to even care.

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Sun May 16, 2004 9:37 pm

Cougar wrote:

You call that a fair run?
The cool babylon 5 epics didn't start until around the third season. Rewatch the Next Generation episodes from the first two seasons. Very few were any good at all. It takes a while for the writing staff and the actors to loosen up. You should give Season 3 an honest run for it's money. It's not perfect but it's good television.

To be honest, I'm very easy to please when it comes to television....but even I couldn't take Enterprise's first season. I did however catch that ep where Enterprise got that episode where Hoshi "looses" her top when she fell out of that hatch. Didn't watch the rest of the episode after that. Didn't really keep my attention, but the only episode that I thought was half-way decent was "Shuttlepod One". B&B are too hung up on time travel to have anything decent written. I don't have any real faith in the next spin-off turning out decent, but I'll give it a shot too.

What ST needs the most is a break. There hasn't been a good ST movie in years (First Contact), and the lack of new ideas is really showing....especially with the shitty turnout for "Nemesis".

TrueLightGuild · Post by **TrueLightGuild** » Mon May 17, 2004 7:44 am

I have all the Star Trek Movies and love them.
I grew up with Star Trek.

You know, I think Wing Commander has been the most realistic space show that I have seen to date. The ships seem real, and they are not doing impossible things, like exceeding the speed of light, which cannot and will not ever be done.
YOU CANNOT GO FASTER THAN THE SPEED OF LIGHT! Albert Einstein.
They have jump points that fold space, but not engines that take them to a speed that would turn your bones to rubber and melt your eyeballs, and even if you were in a bottle of water, the water would turned to vapor and you would too.
Also, who in their right mind could possibly believe we could do any of those things in a couple more centures?
You might reach another star system in the next 5 or 6 hundred centuries if they would get off the big engine thaang, and start looking into different modes of travel.

Santrix · Post by **Santrix** » Mon May 17, 2004 11:50 am

The only show on UPN I liked other than Voyager and Enterprise was 7 Days.

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Mon May 17, 2004 12:56 pm

Well, I only had the opportunity to watch a couple of episodes. I did see some of the later shows and I liked the cool space battles and the pistols and the ships were really creative but the actors seemed way to mechanical somehow. I did watch more than 15 minutes. I actually watched a couple of shows.

Actually, I loved the first few episodes of Enterprise where they were actually exploreing a bit rather than just shooting each other in space battles. The original Star Trek was about exploreing new worlds and they weren't just big special effects firework displays in space. However, those are fun and it is nice to see the new shows involveing some big fleet battles for once.

Next, Cougar, I'm not stupid. I understand the whole T'Pol thing but it has been drug out a little long. There were also other elements here and there that were totally pointless. I just don't think sex was originally planned as one of the main elements of the Star Trek storyline. I mean, I remember watching these shows when I was little because my family and i trusted them to be safe shows for me to watch at the time and I of course loved space shows. I feel that this is an insult to the series.

Look at it today, sex is in every friggin' show we see. There are some shows that the whole storyline revolves around sex. Why can't we have an area where it isn't involved that much? Sure it's a natural function but so is takeing a dump. Do we see that everywhere? No.

It's not that when I see it I go, ewwww discusting..... sex, that is discusting. What I say is, can't they be a little more creative? What I see when a show has this as one of the main areas talked about, it shows that the director didn't have the creativity or genetils to develope a show without it and that he must feel that his show sucks so much that he has to bring out ol' betty. The easiest trick in the book to make fast money for those who are voyeurs.

I'm sure they could have found a better way to develope her character. I mean, Spock was awsome and showed a great friendship to Kirk, yet he didn't need to have sex with the crew to do so.

Now, this show seems to be pretty good but I didn't like it dropping to that level.

I hate to say it guys, but other people have opinions too.

Top Wop · Post by **Top Wop** » Mon May 17, 2004 1:24 pm

To add to that, how do you expect to improve your ratings if you shut off your younger audience? Nobody will let their kids watch that crap.

Anyway back on topic, UPN is not the station to be in if you expect your series to suceed. Thats probably half of the problem.

The other half is B&B got to go. They are fresh out of ideas and its time for someone new at the helm. The sooner they go the better.

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Mon May 17, 2004 1:46 pm

Hey TrueLightGuild, I think Telep wrote the Wing Commander novels and he wrote Space Above and Beyond (Possibly my favorite Sci Fi series) and he wrote the Descent novels although I didn't care for them. You should check out the series Space Above And Beyond though. It was pretty reallalistic. It was all war too, and some of best looking space battles I've seen in a TV series.

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Mon May 17, 2004 3:54 pm

mob-messenger wrote:*snip...* and he wrote Space Above and Beyond (Possibly my favorite Sci Fi series) and he wrote the Descent novels although I didn't care for them. You should check out the series Space Above And Beyond though. It was pretty reallalistic. It was all war too, and some of best looking space battles I've seen in a TV series.

Oh I loved S:AAB! That show actually had continuity and an overall story arc! Then stupid ass Fox had to can it before they could even finish the first season because it wasn't up to their "standards" (meaning it didn't cator to the morons that watch "reality tv" and it didn't have boobs flying around every couple of seconds) Granted, the fighters weren't all that realistic (as far as relativity goes), but thats ignorable.

Another show I'm hooked on is Futurama. That show deserved more than what it got out of Fox. It was wacky, original, and *gasp* had continuity! Think of it as an animated Farscape....only no alien ship. Its got a few sexual referneces here and there, but its in the context of the show and used as a comedic gag instead of being thrown in just to attract horny teenagers. The constant piss-takes on Star Wars and other popular movies were a hoot!

I especially loved the episode where the Omicronians first showed up.

"Kip, what is that thing?" - Zap Brennigan
"The alien mothership sir..." - Kip
"Then what did we blow up?" - Zap Brennigan
"The Hubble Space Telescope sir...." - Kip

TrueLightGuild · Post by **TrueLightGuild** » Mon May 17, 2004 4:24 pm

Mob- I will check Amazon.com to see if they have it on DVD.
I have ordered hundreds of sci-fi from them and man do they get it delivered fast!
Nothing bad to say about them.

It really amazes me to see people give bad reviews to some movies, when I found them to be the ones that I can watch over and over again, and never get tired of them
That is the way it is with Dune, Children of Dune, Wing Commander, and some other movies.
I wonder if the ones giving the reviews should be the ones giving the reviews, or maybe they should watch Andy and Barney instead. I have found it is always better to make up ones on mind about anything, because the world is full really strange aliens in my opinion, and they should find their way back to their lost ship, and their own planet.

Kyouryuu · Post by **Kyouryuu** » Tue May 18, 2004 8:53 pm

The show has been renewed for a fourth season:
http://www.trektoday.com/news/180504_01.shtml

Cougar · Post by **Cougar** » Tue May 18, 2004 9:42 pm

And how. Great news.