D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Descent mission help and more WARNING: Spoilers inside!

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Re: D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Post by kakhome1 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:23 am

All three levels have an hxm. I don't know what changes in the hxm's may have actually existed in the non-split version and which ones don't. Is there any way to see if any D1 or D2 robots were altered in the non-split hxm? DLE won't load hxm's.

HXM changes also include robot AI and item drop probability, all properties of robots, not just weapons. At worst case, Sirius should know if he modified D1 or D2 robots at all.
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Re: D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Post by Sirius » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:54 am

The D1/D2 robots were supposed to be stock, but I didn't actually make the split version myself so I can't be 100% sure what it did. That is more or less also the answer to the cold-start question: it wasn't really intended to be split (even though the layout facilitates it) so I didn't test it that way, and can't make any guarantees it will be any fun if played that way.

I recall there were a few things not working properly in current versions of XL, the robot makers particularly I think? I've meant to go clean that up at some point and release a revised version so I can put it up on my co-op schedule...

Regarding size, Anthology is about 5500 cubes, which puts it at 5-6 times the size of the biggest normal D2 levels - though the cubes are used a bit less efficiently in the D3 section so it may feel a little smaller.

Regarding music, I did think about what kind of music might be appropriate, maybe something very long - I had a MIDI version of "A Change of Seasons" which I played from time to time while working on the level. Eventually I decided not to add custom music though, partly because it wasn't important enough to do anything questionable with IP law (and I didn't have anything sanctioned by its author), and partly because I wasn't really sure whether anything I was thinking of would be well-received by players... best to stick to what I'm good at, they can find their own music :)
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Re: D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Post by kakhome1 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:58 am

Do robots still work okay in XL 1.16.27? If they don't work entirely as intended, is the level still playable and how much does it affect things?
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Re: D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Post by AlexanderBorisov » Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:10 pm

Sirius, and did you noticed any significant differences in robot behavior in XL vs Rebirth (when you played Anthology)? I am mostly concerned about this lifter rush. They charge with enormous speed, take most of you shields in single touch (on Insane difficulty), and have enormous push. Definitely not like in any version of D1-D2.
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Re: D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Post by Sirius » Wed Aug 02, 2017 11:33 pm

The AI is most definitely different - in XL robots will keep shooting at you even when you're behind a wall. They would never do that in other versions of D2.

The Agent Smith lifters, on the other hand, are not something I've personally seen (though I haven't had the chance to play XL much lately). I'd assume it's a bug.
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Re: D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Post by Xfing » Thu Aug 03, 2017 4:43 am

Sirius wrote:The AI is most definitely different - in XL robots will keep shooting at you even when you're behind a wall. They would never do that in other versions of D2.
Wrong, they do that in Rebirth too. In Descent 2 only, of course. They expect you to pop out of cover at any time, so they fire in hopes their projectiles will zap you when that happens.
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Re: D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Post by kakhome1 » Thu Aug 03, 2017 4:59 am

How serious are robot generator issues in Anthology (using XL 1.16.27)?
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Re: D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Post by AlexanderBorisov » Thu Aug 03, 2017 5:44 am

Yes, me too, see robots shooting from behind a wall every time.(on latest Rebirth). Do you think it is worth reporting crazy lifters (of course I have to double check this behavior) to Diedel in hope it will be fixed, or just try to find the older version where it is ok?
Also, this thing that robots see you and begin to shoot from any distance in XL is a bit annoying. Can create problems with some strong robots and especially bosses. I'd like this thing to be optional in XL settings (as with any other differences from the original). Also interested to hear what problem with matcens does XL have?
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Re: D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Post by LightWolf » Thu Aug 03, 2017 6:20 am

I think you should remove the HXM before reporting the lifters - I have noticed a bug with older versions of DLE that copies HXM data from... somewhere, so there is a chance that Mantid data was copied from TEW (or some similar robot).
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Re: D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Post by AlexanderBorisov » Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:49 am

Thanks, will test it too, apart from lifter behavior in other campaigns under XL.
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Re: D1 Apocayptic Factor - Level 2 broken

Post by Sirius » Thu Aug 03, 2017 8:26 am

Xfing wrote:Wrong, they do that in Rebirth too. In Descent 2 only, of course. They expect you to pop out of cover at any time, so they fire in hopes their projectiles will zap you when that happens.
It's not the same thing... they shoot a few shots after you disappear, but give up more quickly, and also don't start shooting again before they can actually see you. They do in XL. It's like they have wall-penetrating radar or something. They also have infinite sight range after you hit them, but that's a bit less weird.

The matcen issue in Anthology was just that the robot list in some of them was wrong, or triggers were linked to the wrong spawner, or something like that. It's been a while. :/ As far as I recall XL doesn't have the Rebirth issue where matcens will suddenly stop working in co-op.
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